Alejandro Ramiréz is Senior Programme Management Officer at the Secretariat of the Multilateral Fund for the Implementation of the Montreal Protocol, which plays a key role in coordinating financial and technical support to developing countries such as Brazil (Article 5) for the phase-out of substances that deplete the Ozone Layer and impact Climate Change. In this Cool Talk, he talks about his first official visit to Brazil and what has changed in the last 15 years.
Please tell us about your work at the Multilateral Fund. And what does your first official visit to Brazil represent (Mission from February 23 to 26)?
The secretariat of the Multilateral Fund is responsible for establishing policies for the financing of projects for the reduction of controlled substances and the review of projects. For our work, this visit is very important because we have the opportunity to see first-hand what is happening in the countries and to be able to understand what challenges the refrigeration and air conditioning sectors, governments, associations and training institutes are facing to implement the projects to phase-out HCFCs and reduce HFCs and to reduce energy use at the same time.
Another important point is to verify the adoption of technologies with low global warming potential (GWP), which implies actions, for example, in the servicing sector, training and certification of technicians.
For us, having this opportunity is very valuable because it can help us not only to facilitate the implementation of projects, but also to think about future financing policies, how to adapt them and how to make sure that they really cover the challenges that countries have.
We have been visiting other countries as well and we can compare and see what the common problems are that countries have and be able to prioritize these challenges.
You were in Brazil 15 years ago and are returning now. Looking at the Brazilian journey from the phase-out of CFCs to the current challenges with HCFCs and HFCs, how do you assess the evolution of the refrigeration and air conditioning (RAC) sector in the country?
Well, after 15 years it is a pleasure to see the progress that has been achieved. This week I had the opportunity to listen to the strategy that the country is designing for the KIP (Kigali Implementation Plan, Brazilian Program for the Reduction of Consumption of HFCs – HFCs Program) and to know that HCFCs have already been phased out in new equipment in the residential and commercial refrigeration sectors, and by the end of Stage III of the HPMP (Hydrofluorocarbons Phase Out Management Plan) the phase out will be complete. This is incredible progress.
Also in the residential air conditioning sector, I was able to observe that companies are already starting to make a transition to intermediate substances, which is also progress, because they will reduce greenhouse gas emissions significantly, since the global warming potential of the substance they are using as an intermediate (R-32) is much lower.
So, this is a step for the long term, and I think that in KIP it is necessary to think long term, because the activities that must be done involve transforming the sector and the technology. There are also many changes taking place at the digital level and in the use of new tools that can help the sector.
The amount of work required to implement these changes is considerable, but the country has the capacity to do so. During this mission, I had the opportunity to visit some companies and see the innovation they are making.
It was also positive to be able to see projects that were carried out with HPMP and to see the companies that converted. They not only made the conversion with the funds provided by the Multilateral Fund but continued to make additional innovations with their own resources and went much further than the project itself.
The same happened with the training centers (the HPMP partner schools). We have seen, for example, that a pilot project is starting for the certification of technicians, and these are points that are long-term, because once the certification is established, it can already be applied in the long term.
During the mission, you visited the Professional Technical School (ETP) in Curitiba, getting to know the laboratory in the "mini supermarket" model with natural refrigerants (R-290 and R-744). What do you think? What is the importance of training projects like these to ensure that the technological transition is safe and efficient at the end, with technicians?
Yes. The laboratory in the "mini supermarket" model that they have here is special. It is a step in the right direction because, as we have seen in manufacturing companies, they are going in this direction, and in (the ETP school they already have the mini supermarket to be able to explain to the technicians how this technology that will come can be used.
Do you consider the new laboratories with CO2 and Propane, created within the framework of the HPMP, an example for other countries?
Yes, of course, it is an example for other countries. I believe that professionals from other countries will come and see what is being done here in Brazil. In these two schools (ETP/Curitiba and SENAI Oscar Rodrigues Alves/São Paulo) it was very illustrative. During the visit to ETP, we were informed that technicians from other countries have already come to receive training here.
Therefore, Brazil is a point of reference, because Brazil also has a lot of manufacturing and, by having manufacturing, they are innovating all the time in technology. For other countries in the region, coming to see what is happening in Brazil is always an advantage.
You also visited the SENAI Oscar Rodrigues Alvez School in São Paulo, and were able to see the new air conditioning laboratory with propane, which offers a course on the safe and efficient use of flammable refrigerants. What did you think of this visit?
I believe that it is a correct step to start having the equipment with the substances of low global warming for the students, so that they become familiar, see what tools they need to do the work and learn the correct practices for maintenance of this equipment.
These low global warming potential technologies have characteristics that are a little different from HCFCs and HFCs. For example, hydrocarbons (such as Propane) have flammability that must be handled correctly and that also probably requires some regulation that helps in the issues of standards, transportation, storage and management throughout the entire refrigerant use chain.
Brazil is doing a good job of looking ahead and starting all these training centers. And not only training, because Brazil is also working on technical standards now, in time, without waiting for the technology to be 100% on the market.
The Kigali Amendment is described as a new task, a learning process for all. What are the main challenges that the Fund identifies for Brazil in the initial stage of the HFCs Program, as a country that can serve as a model for other countries (especially developing countries, from Article 5)?
I believe that one of the main challenges for Brazil and for many countries is the management of data, the understanding of imports, of mixtures. One of the differences between the control of HFCs and HCFCs is the amount of controlled substances. And not only that, there are substances that are controlled, but are being used as alternatives to other controlled substances. It is complex.
These substances are often part of mixtures, which may be mixed within the country. This makes it very difficult to understand this map of substances and flows. I believe that in Stage I of the KIP (HFCs Program), for all countries, but especially for the larger ones, this is one of the challenges in understanding the situation.
Reaching a 10% reduction in the year 2029 can also be a challenge, depending on what the consumption trend is in the countries, and that is why the data is important.
One of the challenges that occurred in the baseline years, which is 2020-2022, was the pandemic, because the pandemic artificially lowered consumption and after the pandemic consumption rose again. These consumption patterns are difficult to understand. That's why data is key.
So, a major challenge for KIP in the world and, therefore, for the HFCs Program in Brazil is to maintain consumption in the transition phase…
Yes, for example, alternatives that are difficult to get in the market right now could be a challenge. And issues related to the distribution chain.
In this case, I believe that Brazil is at an advantage and by starting to work on the KIP, it will not only help Brazil, but also the countries of the region, because it will create demand and send a very large signal to the market about the direction that is going to be taken. Several countries that may currently be experiencing problems with the supply of alternative substances and components may benefit when Brazil starts working on the KIP, in the HFCs Program.
With about 140 million dollars allocated to projects in Brazil, which sectors or initiatives do you consider to be the most impactful of the Montreal Protocol so far?
Yes, I can highlight many actions. All of them are important and perhaps you can't do one without doing the others. We can't change manufacturing if we don't train technicians. We cannot train the technicians if we do not bring new technology. What if there were no standards? In this way, all actions are related, connected and important.
The lesson learned, or what can be said about Brazil, is that in all areas there has been good progress.
But one of the things to highlight is how the Ministry of the Environment and Climate Change and IBAMA (Brazilian Institute of Environment and Renewable Natural Resources) work together to regulate and control substances. This is fundamental and has been the basis and pillar for establishing a working foundation (in actions related to the Montreal Protocol).
Then, I highlight the partnerships that were made between the private sector, government and training centers (HPMP partner schools), which are very important because everyone must be working together.
Also, commercial refrigeration projects, such as the companies I had the opportunity to visit, have done an excellent job and will also have an impact on HFCs, because they have managed to introduce low-GWP alternatives, such as CO₂ with hydrocarbons in cascade systems. This already has an impact on the HFC Program.
And the training of technicians, the partnership they have with SENAI (and other technical schools), which had a significant impact on the number of trained technicians in the country. I believe that this must continue and it must be expanded because training will be fundamental.
The basis for continuing the work has been established and I believe that we must think about the long term. This is a job for the next 15 years and not to hesitate to do things that seem difficult because they will take several years, for example: certification. This is a project that will take years, but once it is established, it will make a significant difference for the country.
Brazil is known as a valuable member of the Fund's committee. How did this political action help Brazil to open new windows that benefit the country, but not only the country, other developing countries?
At the level of the Executive Committee, Brazil has been an important member. Brazil has been present at all the meetings, whether as a member or as a co-opted member, and Brazil has a very high-level representation that has been fundamental in the discussions.
When there are difficult processes, Brazil is always present in the discussions of the contact groups, in the discussions in the corridors, trying to represent and defend the point of view of the (developing) countries of Article 5. This is very important to come up with solutions.
Brazil's role is important in the committee and has shown results, because we were able to make decisions on the preparation of inventories on controlled substances, which is part of Life Cycle Refrigerant Management, and decisions on opportunities for climate benefits in energy efficiency, both for the servicing sector and the manufacturing sector.
Energy efficiency is an important field because phasing out HFCs will allow for a transformation of technology and ignoring energy efficiency while doing so would be a mistake. So, it is important to take it into account.
What is the result, the legacy, of all this visit (mission) of yours to Brazil?
I believe that one of the outcomes of this mission for us at the Secretariat is to gain a better first-hand understanding from the main actors of the challenges they are facing. This will help us in establishing future financing policies to ensure that assistance from the Multilateral Fund reaches its intended destination and can have, shall we say, the impact we want it to have.
In terms of legacy, I believe that for Brazil, having its KIP (future HFCs Program) approved this year will be an important turning point in the work of implementing the Kigali Amendment.
And I believe that what I saw in this strategic mission, which was designed by the government with the assistance of agencies (UNDP, UNIDO, and GIZ), is heading in the right direction and that Brazil will be a key factor in the implementation of the Kigali Amendment.
COOL TALK – By Susana Ferraz, journalist, communication advisor for GIZ (Sete Estrelas Comunicação).
